Ambassador Fidelis Tapgun was a one one time Plateau state governorship candidate, under the defunct Social Democratic Party , SDP, between 1992 to 1993, during the short-lived Babangida.
After the return to democracy in 1999, he was appointed Ambassador to Kenya in 2000. He was Director-General of the Obasanjo-Atiku Campaign Organisation between 2002 and 2003, helping to ensure that Obasanjo was re-elected in the April 2003 elections.
He was a onetime Minister of Industry, a gubernatorial aspirant in 2011 polls and also a Papal Knight. In this exclusive interview with DailyPost correspondent, AGABUS PWANAGBA, the ace politician speaks on how the PDP governors have hijacked the party, praising the reform agenda of the sitting PDP Chairman, Bamanga Turku. He also blamed the National Assembly for hijacking constitutional amendment, saying that APC can never be a threat to PDP.
The reforms of the Bamanga Tukur led PDP is been rejected in some quarters, especially amongst the PDP Governors. What is your take on that?
People who are talking, and refusing these reforms were not there when PDP was formed. They don’t know the philosophy behind the formation of PDP. Those of them who were there know this, but because overtime, they have eroded the powers of the people, they are enjoying it, so they don’t want to let go.
What is the way out?
The way out is for the reforms to go ahead, because the party must go back to the people. Where did we get the slogan “Power to the People?”, that’s where the slogan came from. It is the people that own the party. PDP was supposed to be a very mass movement, it doesn’t belong to anybody, it belongs to the people themselves, they should decide what happens in the party. But overtime, certain things just happened, and gradually these things were taken away and given to Governors and then, it became a problem. You know people who grab power don’t want to leave it. And if you don’t force them to leave it, they will not leave it. These are part of the recommendations of our reconciliation committee. We said in that report that people should now be made to pay subscription as it was meant to be from the beginning, so that they can own the party. If they pay their membership subscription every year, it’s a large amount of money. Then the party can function on its own, not depending on the Governors, local government chairmen or the presidency.
Is there any specific amount that is supposed to be paid as subscription?
No, no, no, just any amount. We said even if it is fifty kobo they ask members to register with all over this country, you will make billions. And I know it’s not going to be fifty kobo. That is why the party is going to do e-registration, so that people can go and register and pay, so we can take away the party from the clutches of the Governors. This is because they control the party so much that nothing happens in the party, local government councils and in the state without their consent. Nobody gets any appointment or anything done until they agree. It’s too much.
The APC has come on board. Do you think the birth of the party could make PDP uncomfortable come 2015?
PDP won’t have any challenge, because of the formation of APC.
The APC has accused the PDP of being behind the formation of the other APC. What can you say about such an allegation?
Well that is what they will say, that’s their problem, the PDP has nothing to do with it as far as I know. It is their own problem and they should know how to sort it out. PDP is a very strong party, its solid on the ground in this country and there is nothing anybody can do about that. That is the truth. There is no polling unit you will go in this country that you will not find a PDP man or woman, none as far as I know. But you can’t say the same of the other parties. So that is why PDP is not bothered about what they’re doing.
Many people have come out to condemn the recent state pardon the council of state granted to some Nigerians, who have committed one crime or the other.
What can you say about such a pardon?
Well, pardon is normally the prerogative of the President, and he has that power in the constitution. There are guidelines for anybody to regain his freedom. These things are relative; people have their own views about this things. It is just a matter of taking a decision, which is what the president has done. The President has the right to pardon criminals in this country.
Some activists said if the President can pardon such criminals, why doesn’t he just pardon all criminals in prisons?
It all depends. Criminals in the prisons, you can’t vouch for them, but in the case of Alamieyeseigha, you can see what he has been doing all over the country. He has been contributing to the government of the day. You go to prisons, people who are remorseful are often freed. Even Governors do that every year; they free people who are remorseful, they grant them pardon. I think what is stipulated in the constitution is that people who are remorseful and show good character can be pardoned.
Why are those in government against the removal of the immunity clause and giving Local Governments autonomy especially Governors in the ongoing constitution review?
In real democracy, the Local Government should be autonomous, so that they can develop at their own pace. So, many things have gone wrong in this constitution. Let me tell you the truth,and everybody knows it. This was a constitution made by the Military. That’s why some people are calling for the convening of this nation conference, so that this things can be looked at again. And the cry of everybody in this country is that the constitution as it is, should be left open for debate in all over the country. However, the National Assembly has taken it upon itself to do it, and they have not done anything, they just played around with it, went back and said they have done it. They begin to claim that they are the sovereign people to take the final decision, it is not true, because I know that prominent lawyers have said they have no right to do that. If they look at it, they should throw it open to the Nigerian public, for a referendum whether Nigerians will agree or not. This is because if they leave it open to the public, all those things would be taken off. On the issue of immunity clause, the argument has always been that, it is for government stability. If you remove that immunity in the constitution, then it becomes a problem, because a lot of things can happen. It can distract government and its ongoing work, be ita Governor or the President. Finish your work, go out, then you face the problem. It’s not that you will escape everything leveled against you; you will face them later, especially once you’re out of office.
It is just that it prevents you from being prosecuted while you’re in office; because it will distract you from your work and people will not benefit from what you are supposed to be doing. I think some weeks ago, the House of Representative wanted immunity for the members of National Assembly, luckily the Senate said no, that they shouldn’t do that. But in this constitution review, they have not allowed people to talk about them, because they didn’t include in the list of what people should talk about, hence, it’s not an impressive work. They will end up spending money on a job that is not going to be useful at the end of the day. Because there is nothing that will change in the constitution.
Some people have described Mr. President’s handling of the security situation in the country as a failure. What is your take on such comments?
That is their view, and you cannot stop people from thinking the way they want to think. But I know the President knows what he is doing on this security matter. This country is a very complex country, and there are certain things you have to handle with care, which is one of the things he is doing. That’s why he told the Borno people that, you know these people and you don’t want to condemn them, then don’t begin to blame the federal government. Some people know those who are doing these things, but they don’t want to talk about them, trying to destabilize the government. But I don’t think it’s good for this country; we want to remain one as a country. The truth is that Nigerian people elected this President to be in office and where it was right or wrong, is not the issue. The issue is that, he is the President of the country, they should allow him to govern.
Ambassador Fidelis Tapgun was a one one time Plateau state governorship candidate, under the defunct Social Democratic Party , SDP, between 1992 to 1993, during the short-lived Babangida.
After the return to democracy in 1999, he was appointed Ambassador to Kenya in 2000. He was Director-General of the Obasanjo-Atiku Campaign Organisation between 2002 and 2003, helping to ensure that Obasanjo was re-elected in the April 2003 elections.
He was a onetime Minister of Industry, a gubernatorial aspirant in
2011 polls and also a Papal Knight. In this exclusive interview with DailyPost correspondent, AGABUS PWANAGBA, the ace politician speaks on how the PDP governors have hijacked the party, praising the reform agenda of the sitting PDP Chairman, Bamanga Turku. He also blamed the National Assembly for hijacking constitutional amendment, saying that APC can never be a threat to PDP.
The reforms of the Bamanga Tukur led PDP is been rejected in some
quarters, especially amongst the PDP Governors. What is your take on that?
People who are talking, and refusing these reforms were
not there when PDP was formed. They don’t know the philosophy behind
the formation of PDP. Those of them who were there know this, but because overtime, they have eroded the powers of the
people, they are enjoying it, so they don’t want to let go.
What is the way out?
The way out is for the reforms to go ahead, because the party must go
back to the people. Where did we get the slogan “Power to the People?”,
that’s where the slogan came from. It is the people that own the party. PDP was supposed to be a very mass movement, it doesn’t belong to anybody, it belongs to the people themselves, they should decide
what happens in the party. But overtime, certain things just happened, and gradually these things were taken away and given to Governors and then, it became a problem. You know people who grab power don’t want to
leave it. And if you don’t force them to leave it, they will not leave it. These are part of the recommendations of our reconciliation committee. We said in that report that people should now be made to pay subscription as it was meant to be from the beginning, so that they can own the party. If they pay their membership subscription every year, it’s a large amount of money. Then the party can function on its own, not depending on the Governors, local government chairmen or the presidency.
Is there any specific amount that is supposed to be paid as subscription?
No, no, no, just any amount. We said even if it is fifty kobo they ask
members to register with all over this country, you will make billions. And I know it’s not going to be fifty kobo. That is why the party is going to do e-registration, so that people can go and
register and pay, so we can take away the party from the clutches of the Governors. This is because they control the party so much that nothing happens
in the party, local government councils and in the state without their consent. Nobody gets any appointment or anything done until they agree. It’s too much.
The APC has come on board. Do you think the birth of the party could make PDP uncomfortable come 2015? PDP won’t have any challenge, because of the formation of APC.
The APC has accused the PDP of being behind the formation of the other APC. What can you say about such an allegation?
Well that is what they will say, that’s their problem, the PDP has nothing to do with it as far as I know. It is their own problem and they should know how to sort it out. PDP is a very strong party, its solid on the ground in this country and there is nothing anybody can
do about that. That is the truth. There is no polling unit you will go in this country that you will not find a PDP man or woman,
none as far as I know. But you can’t say the same of the other parties. So that is why PDP is not bothered about what they’re doing.
Many people have come out to condemn the recent state pardon the council of state granted to some Nigerians, who have committed one crime or the other. What can you say about such a pardon?
Well, pardon is normally the prerogative of the President, and he has that power in the constitution. There are guidelines for anybody to
regain his freedom. These things are relative; people have their own
views about this things. It is just a matter of taking a decision, which is what the president has done. The President has the right to
pardon criminals in this country.
Some activists said if the President can pardon such criminals, why
doesn’t he just pardon all criminals in prisons?
It all depends. Criminals in the prisons, you can’t vouch for them, but
in the case of Alamieyeseigha, you can see what he has been doing all
over the country. He has been contributing to the government of the day. You go to prisons, people who are remorseful are often freed. Even Governors do that every year; they free people who are remorseful, they grant them pardon. I
think what is stipulated in the constitution is that people who are
remorseful and show good character can be pardoned.
Why are those in government against the removal of the immunity clause and giving Local Governments autonomy especially Governors in the ongoing constitution review?
In real democracy, the Local Government should be autonomous, so that
they can develop at their own pace. So, many things have gone wrong in this constitution. Let me tell you the truth,and everybody knows it. This was a constitution made by the Military. That’s why
some people are calling for the convening of this nation conference,
so that this things can be looked at again. And the cry of everybody in this country is that the constitution as it is, should be left open for debate in all over the country. However, the National Assembly has taken it upon
itself to do it, and they have not done anything, they just played
around with it, went back and said they have done it. They begin to claim
that they are the sovereign people to take the final decision, it is
not true, because I know that prominent lawyers have said they have no right to do that. If they look at it, they should throw it open to the Nigerian public, for a referendum whether Nigerians will agree or not. This is because
if they leave it open to the public, all those things would be
taken off. On the issue of immunity clause, the argument has always been that, it is for government stability. If you remove
that immunity in the constitution, then it becomes a problem, because
a lot of things can happen. It can distract government and its ongoing work, be ita Governor or the President. Finish your work, go out, then you face the problem. It’s not that you will escape everything leveled against you; you will face them later, especially once you’re out of office.
It is just that it prevents you from being prosecuted while you’re in
office; because it will distract you from your work and people will
not benefit from what you are supposed to be doing. I think some weeks ago, the House of Representative wanted immunity for the members of
National Assembly, luckily the Senate said no, that they shouldn’t do
that. But in this constitution review, they have not
allowed people to talk about them, because they didn’t include in the
list of what people should talk about, hence, it’s not an impressive work. They will end up spending money on a job that is not going to be useful at the end of
the day. Because there is nothing that will change in the constitution.
Some people have described Mr. President’s handling of the security situation in the country as a failure. What is your take on such comments?
That is their view, and you cannot stop people from thinking the way they want to think. But I know the President knows what he is doing on this security matter. This country is a very complex country, and
there are certain things you have to handle with care, which is one of the things he is doing. That’s why he told the Borno people that, you
know these people and you don’t want to condemn them, then don’t begin
to blame the federal government. Some people know those who are doing
these things, but they don’t want to talk about them, trying to
destabilize the government. But I don’t think it’s good for this country; we want to remain one as a country. The truth is that Nigerian people elected this President to be in office and where it was right or wrong, is not the
issue. The issue is that, he is the President of the country, they
should allow him to govern.
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